Consolmagno is Talking About Baptizing Aliens Again

Just as the dust is settling from the Vatican’s latest astrobiology conference in Arizona, heralded as “The Search Exo-Vaticanafor Life Beyond the Solar System: Exoplanets, Biosignature & Instruments,” Jesuit astronomer Guy Consolmagno is out in public talking about baptizing extraterrestrials again. In fact, over the years quite a few Jesuit members of the Vatican Observatory Research Group (VORG) have made public statements concerning the baptism of extraterrestrials. The first was back in 1993 when then-acting VORG director George Coyne announced at the launch of the VATT facility that “the Church would be obliged to address the question of whether extraterrestrials might be brought within the fold and baptized.”[1] In a New York Times magazine article—titled “Would You Baptize an Extraterrestrial?”—another VORG astronomer, Chris Corbally, indicated he would baptize extraterrestrials as well.[2] Similarly, back in 2010 when asked whether he’d baptize an alien, Guy Consolmagno replied, “Only if they asked” and then qualified, “Any entity—no matter how many tentacles it has, has a soul.”[3] Now Consolmagno is taking his intergalactic evangelism aspirations to the halls of academia delivering a lecture called “Would you baptize an Extra-Terrestrial?” at Leeds Trinity University in the UK. Here is a recent article announcing the upcoming lecture:

Would you baptise an alien?

That is the unusual question posed to students in Leeds by one of the Pope’s astronomers. Scientifictheories and religion look set to collide in a talk by leading papal astronomer Brother Guy Consolmagno SJ. The acclaimed astronomer and Jesuit will share why astronomical research is so important to the Vatican.Brother Guy is based at the Vatican Observatory headquarters in Castel Gandolfo and he curates the Vatican meteorite collection, which is believed to be one of the largest in the world. He will deliver a lecture called “Would you baptize an Extra-Terrestrial?” at Leeds Trinity University, which is based in Horsforth.

Read more at The Yorkshire Evening Post

The Catholic belief is that baptism “confers grace ex opere operato, that is, the sacrament works of itself.”[4] This literally means the ritual itself takes away sin without requiring faith in the Gospel. This is also why unbaptized infants cannot go to heaven, according to Rome.[5] While the dissonance with Vatican II style inclusivism is deafening, theological harmony is not a strong suit for Rome. The Council of Trent declared: “If anyone denies that by the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, which is conferred in baptism, the guilt of original sin is remitted, or even asserts that the whole of that which has the true and proper nature of sin is not taken away, but says that it is only touched in person or is not imputed, let him be anathema.”[6] While that curses just about all evangelicals, biblically based doctrine recognizes baptism as an outward sign of what has already occurred in the heart of the believer (Mark 16:16). When you recognize that you are dead in your sins and believe that Christ died for you and rose from the dead, you are justified in God’s eyes (Romans 10:10). It is a heart condition in reference to the propositional content of the Gospel (1 Corinthians 15:3–5). False baptisms and conversions are commonplace. Baptism does not save anyone or remove sin. Nevertheless, the Catholic priest erroneously believes the sacrament itself has supernatural power to remove sin and consequently, could be deceived into thinking a baptized alien entity would be in a state of grace as well. Even if these viral media statements about the baptism of aliens seem tongue in cheek, it could be part of a more subtle effort to influence public opinion. If a deceptive entity were to pose as an ET, Rome would likely be taken in.

If you would like a signed copy of Exo-Vaticana from me personally order here.
In LA Mazulli’s Watchers 7 I discuss Rome’s ET connection along wwith some surprising revelations concerning the Pope’s ET connection by UFOlogist Jaime Maussan. If you would like a Watchers 7 DVD order here.


[1] Bruce Johnston , “Vatican Sets Evangelical Sights on Outer Space,” Daily Telegraph (London, England, Oct. 28, 1992), 15.

[2]Jack Hitt, “Would You Baptize an Extraterrestrial?” New York Times magazine, last accessed January 19, 2013,http://www.nytimes.com/1994/05/29/magazine/would-you-baptize-an-extraterrestrial.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm.

 [3] Richard Alleyne, “Pope Benedict XVI’s Astronomer: The Catholic Church Welcomes Aliens,” The Telegraph, last accessed January 19, 2013, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/8009299/Pope-Benedict-XVIs-astronomer-the-Catholic-Church-welcomes-aliens.html.

[4] Millard J. Erickson, Christian Theology., 2nd ed. (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Book House, 1998), 1100.

[5] “It (The Roman Church) teaches…that the souls…of those who die in mortal sin, or with only original sin descend immediately into hell; however, to be punished with different penalties and in different places.” Henry Denzinger, Roy J. Deferrari, and Karl Rahner, The Sources of Catholic Dogma (St. Louis, MO: B. Herder Book Co., 1954), 193. The Council of Trent declared: “If anyone denies that by the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ which is conferred in Baptism, the guilt of original sin is remitted; or even assert that the whole of that which has the true and proper nature of sin is not taken way…let him be anathema.” Henry Denzinger, Sources of Catholic Dogma, 247). Thus, without baptism, original sin is not remitted and according to the above infants would descend immediately into hell. Older Catholic theologians speculated about a place called “limbo,” which was less severe than hell.

 [6]Henry Denzinger, Roy J. Deferrari, and Karl Rahner, The Sources of Catholic Dogma (St. Louis, MO: B. Herder Book Co., 1954), 247.

About Cris Putnam
Logos Apologia is the ministry of Cris D. Putnam. The mission of Logos Apologia is to show that logic, science, history and faith are complementary, not contradictory and to bring that life-changing truth to everybody who wants to know.

Comments

  1. Richard E says:

    If the LDS could just get their names and genealogy I wonder if they would?;-)

    Doesn’t Enoch focus on the point that God said no provision could be made whereby the fallen angels or their offspring would ever have any hope other than hell itself? How is it anyone would teach baptism for them? I’d suggest it would be of no more effect than an LDS proxy baptism for the dead. Jesus taught that ones fate is sealed at death and no one can cross over the great abyss between the evil and the good. The abyss is the depths of hell prepared for Satan and his own – and was never intended for men – but many choose to go there when they refuse Gods’ plea to repent and do as He said. (the doctrine of God taught by Jesus Christ – the Torah, Psalms and Prophets revealed and glorified.)

  2. lisag says:

    Stop lying about what the Catholic Church teaches. A partial truth is not the Truth.

    • Cris Putnam says:

      I quoted from official Catholic theology.For your accusation to carry any weight you would need to show what specifically I have overlooked with documented sources. You have not done so…

    • Chuckles says:

      Seems Cris has hit a nerve. Good.

      As a former Catholic myself, I can vouch for what Cris has posted regarding RC doctrine. Anyone who doubts it can simply check the official RC Catechism which is posted online. (No, I won’t include a link here since this reply would be swallowed up in moderation if I did.)

    • remnant1947 says:

      Nope that’s canon law. Which you’ve placed yourself under by adhering to RCC. Strange Catholics worry about our beliefs only to bolster their cultish beliefs…But care nothing for our souls. Thus no evangelism. We care they are being lied to. Men are liars and the popes are the biggest.

  3. Vic says:

    IDK, the Bible speaks about signs in the heavens maybe, but Jesus himself would have
    not been oblique, or even ‘hint’ or ‘tease’ us of some alien/fallen angel invasion or visitation in the future,
    I believe Jesus would have specifically forecasted something like this in great detail, screaming
    from the rooftops saying: ‘Hey guys, there are Fallen Angels pretending to be extraterrestrials that will
    land on Earth one day” ‘…But Jesus never was specific about aliens from space landing on Earth, you
    simply can’t find that in Scripture….it’s not there at all other that what one can extrapolate from ‘hint’s’
    in scripture, but Jesus would never ‘hint’, he would be emphatic, specific, warning with great and massive importance in a LOUD VOICE on almost every page in the NT about aliens/angels coming in UFO’s, but I cannot find it…it’s not there, even Paul didn’t say anything about
    a coming alien/fallen angel invasion coming in Spaceships…nothing, zip, zero, nada.
    All we have from Scripture is a coming great deception one day, and that’s the problem, we’re speculating
    on what that deception is…and that ‘deception’ could be anything…anything, and who’s to say we’ll even
    be ALIVE at the time it happens? This could 100 or 500 years from now for all we know.
    I know the UFO thing ”sells” the most, but nobody really knows, and Jesus would have warned us very specifically, and would not leave us ‘hanging’ on this issue.
    As for Consolmagno, he’s of no importance, Scripture is, I can name a hundred other Catholics over the centuries that have said crazier things, what Consolmagno quotes doesn’t apply and, he too may be long dead and gone centuries before the Jesus comes back anyway, and who’s to say theoretically if aliens arrive, a Buddhist, Muslim, or a Wiccan representative won’t get to them first?

    • Cris Putnam says:

      Vic,
      I don’t find that argument very compelling. For example, what about nuclear weapons? Today we have the power to destroy the entire planet and kill off every human alive. But Jesus did not specifically warn us about nuclear weapons. Yet, I know they are very real. So your argument just doesn’t match the evidence. However Jesus did say,”people fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world. For the powers of the heavens will be shaken.” (Lk 21:26) “coming on the world” implies it originates off world.

    • hopeful_watcher says:

      Yes, the whole “it doesn’t say, so it can’t be so” is not convincing to me either.

      I believe Jesus was vague about the deception, because until His return, satan is still prince of the air and thus would just change tactics away from the warnings. Satan knows scripture better than anyone.

      So what is left is the solution to the deception, which is the one thing Satan can not manipulate, which is faith in the redemptive power of Jesus’s death on the cross.

  4. Deirdre says:

    Wow. Weird.

  5. Vic says:

    Jesus never spoke about nuclear weapons, however the Book Of Daniel states knowledge will increase and nuclear weapons are the one of the many results of that increased knowledge….We simply do not know what Luke 21:26 is specifically speaking of…what’s coming on the World in some yet unknown future could be almost any phenomena natural, man made or cosmic in nature, but “aliens” and whatnot is just absurd and there is no Biblical foundation for that one whatsoever…what’s dangerous about speculating about what Luke 21 specifically may mean is that it leaves the door open for anything….Fire Breathing Dragons coming from Holllow Earth like the movie “Reign Of Fire”, an invasion of Dwarfs from Mars, Eight legged Arachnid Creatures from Venus, etc., it leaves the door open to crowbar too many fantastical things from the imaginations of men from the foundation of a very brief Biblical passage…a passage that may or may not not be speaking to a 21st century populous in the first place if one leans towards a preterist or partial preterist point of view.
    Trust me, if Scripture said anything about Angry Dwarfs from Mars, Aliens or whatever, I’m with you 100%, but it just doesn’t Mr. Putnam, it just doesn’t. One can justify a million things about what event Luke 21:26 is and interpret ANY wild possibility, when temperance, and another Jesus’ quote in Scripture about not being anxious for tomorrow in any way shape or form is also a quote of his as levity to his apocalyptic quote about men fainting with fear in some possible future event….Nuclear Weapons Men can control to a point, but a theoretical ‘Alien Invasion’ is something Entirely different, completely beyond our control, and wholly unscriptural.

    • Daniel says:

      To add to what Chris said, Chris also taught in parables for a very good reason. Those to seek out the Truth out of true repentance and a willingness to come to that Truth will be lead by the Holy Spirit. Those that are lost won’t be able to find the Truth so that they may pervert it (you can even find Truth left in the LDS perversion of a bible becasue they couldn’t root it all out for this reason)

      Mark 4:10-13
      And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

      2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
      Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

      2 Corinthians 4:3-4
      But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

      So no, Jesus will not spell things out to you directly sorry (Proverbs 25:2). But if you want a starting place to be like a king and search the matter out then by all means “But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.” Start there…

    • jaz says:

      If Lk21;26 refers to “the Powers of heaven being shaken” then it is to be understood that the fear of men will be the result of catastrophic events such as weather abnormalities of disastrous proportions. This Isaiah also spoke of Isaiah24:18-20

  6. Joseph D'Hippolito says:

    “…theological harmony is not a strong suit for Rome.”

    In other news….

    1. Pope is Catholic
    2. Water is wet
    3. 2+2=4
    4. Bears hibernate in winter
    5. Cubs haven’t won World Series in more than a century…

    The reason that the introductory fragment above is correct is because the Catholic Church has made a habit of re-writing theology to suit its purposes. Two examples: the Vatican’s position on Islam and on capital punishment.

    The issue with the Vatican isn’t “theological harmony.” It’s power, pure and simple.

  7. Vic says:

    Thing is, the context of ‘as the days of Noah were’ verse has been twisted by the popular
    teachers that focus WAY too much on the modern Nephilim theory, when clearly the context of that passage
    is judgment on a completely unsuspecting world going about their daily lives if one reads the further
    down in that very same passage.

    • jaz says:

      I agree………… the nephilim Crap is just that… Crap, to put it bluntly……

    • Daniel says:

      As for the context of ‘as the days of Noah were’ verse; I don’t think looking to Noah’s time is taking it out of context.

      “They did eat, they drank, THEY married WIVES, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all” -Luke 17:27

      “That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and THEY took them WIVES of all which they chose.” Genesis 6:2

      Seems contextual to me! Ask yourself who THEY were?

      And if you want to believe God slaughtered the whole world by a flood because of sin, then ask yourself what makes you so special?! Now my answer as to why I think I am special and don’t deserve the judgment rained down on those of the antediluvian period is that I am a human being bought with the blood of Jesus and they were the half-breed bastard offspring of the fallen angels that are nonredeemable. Death is my day of reckoning. Life was theirs.

      Further, then why all the alien hype out of Hollywood? I know this is not an observation based in the Bible but it should not be ignored either. It’s taken Hollywood a lot of time and money to make this reality:

      According to a National Geographic survey, 77 percent of all Americans “believe there are signs that aliens have visited Earth”, and according to a recent Harris poll only 68 percent of all Americans believe that Jesus is God or the Son of God.

      You brought up Dwarfs [from Mars], and that was the demonic deception of centuries past along with elves, spirits, etc. A whole bunch of people once believed in them too. Aliens are the 21 century version of that. Look into the ministries that deals with alien abductions in the here and NOW if you want to learn how real the threat is and how threatening the name of Jesus is to those that claim to come in peace. It’s also interesting note all the testimonies of the abductees and the message brought to them by the aliens too (Galatians 1:8).

      I will use my own discernment to make up my own mind. If I’m wrong, then no biggie. I always tell people this is a possibility for the great deception. But if I’m right then the false alien gods will not deceive me. It’s always best to know all the different devices of Satan and when he throws one your way you will be forearmed (because you were forewarned).

      When it comes to Biblical prophecy, have the humility to change your point of view based on the events that unfold for we see through a glass dimly. It’s the rock of salvation, Jesus Christ, that we should hold onto without compromise. If we can agree to that then the most you can lose is your earthly life.

  8. cyberpriest says:

    Catholic baptism is not scriptural..
    Baptism for the remission of sin is only valid when it is on the basis of faith Acts2:38 as is repentance.
    Saul was told by Ananias “Arise and be baptised and wash away your sins calling on the name of the Lord” Acts22:16
    ‘By Faith alone’ does not negate the necessity for baptism, for the ordinance was established as part of the work of God unto salvation by Jesus Christ “he who believes and is baptised will be saved” Mk16:16

    • Daniel says:

      You are correct. I’ve heard it put this way:

      Another error that many make with Acts 2:38 is the error of assumption. It is assumed that the word “for” must mean “in order to get.” That is, being baptized “for” the remission of sins supposedly means to be baptized “in order to get” remission of sins. However, a closer look at the scriptures will reveal that this isn’t the case at all.

      Notice Luke 5:12-14: “And it came to pass, when he was in a certain city, behold a man full of leprosy: who seeing Jesus fell on his face, and besought him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will: be thou clean. And immediately the leprosy departed from him. And he charged him to tell no man: but go, and shew thyself to the priest, and offer for thy cleansing, according as Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.” Jesus made this man clean in verse 13, yet in the next verse, verse 14, Jesus tells him to go offer a sacrifice “for thy cleansing” as a “testimony.” Here the word “for” cannot mean “in order to get” because he had already gotten his cleansing in verse 13! It obviously meant “because of” his cleansing. If a man goes to jail “for stealing,” then he goes there “because of” the stealing that he’s already done, not “in order to get” a chance to steal again.

      From biblebelievers DOT com

      • louthesaint says:

        The Holy Spirit cannot abide nor impart eternal life where Sin has not been remitted/washed away..
        Reader; It does not mean that the Holy Spirit is not working and cannot work in one’s life prior to their Baptism. For God is a Gracious God..
        It was Saul that was blinded by the Light on the damascus Road and yet he still had to be baptised for the remission of sin Acts22:16 and thereafter he was commissioned as Apostle Paul.
        The baptism of John was not the same baptism which the disciples were commissioned to perform.. That baptism (John’s) was no longer valid after the Death and resurrection of Jesus..Apollos was teaching John’s baptism to the Jews at Ephesus. Upon hearing this,Aquila and Priscilla “expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly” Acts18:25-26
        When Paul came to Ephesus he found 12 men that needed to be baptised “in the Name of Christ”having previously received John’s baptism Acts 19:3-5
        John’s baptism could not cause the believer to be ‘UNITED TOGETHER’ in the likeness of Jesus’ death and resurrection Rom6:5 For Jesus had not yet made the way for this oneness by the provision of His cleansing blood.
        It is the Blood that washes away sin and purges the conscience Heb 9:14 This is the providence of God for sinners.. Baptism is the way which God ordained for the effectiveness of the cleansing Blood to be applied to the believer.. Hence Apostle Peter on the day of pentecost said to the repentants who were “pierced to the heart”
        “Let each of you be baptised fro the remission of your sins; and you shall receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit” Acts 2:38.
        That pattern is followed right Through the Acts of the Apostles in association with the laying on of Hands..
        Salvation is not effective to the believer until such Time as the remission of His/her sins has taken place.. that is why Apostle Peter can boldly say using Noah’s flood in analogy “Baptism Now saves You” 1Pet 3:20,21

        What begins with The sinners prayer must follow the ordained precepts of God, if one is willing to enter into the Fulness of Life.

        • Chuckles says:

          “Salvation is not effective to the believer until such Time as the remission of His/her sins has taken place.”

          But such remission of sins takes place at the time of believing, not at the time of water baptism.

          If remission of sins took place at water baptism, the one being baptized would be–in effect–saying this:

          “I am being baptized today because even though I have believed on Christ I am not yet saved. I am still in my sins and my sins will not be washed away until I am baptized in water. So although I now stand before you as a filthy, unforgiven sinner, in just a moment I’m going to come up out of the water saved and forgiven. My salvation depends not only on Christ’s work, but also on my work. My salvation is conditioned, not only on faith, but on my being obedient to water baptism.”

          Nothing biblical there. That is what’s known as “a different gospel”.

          A biblical testimony would go more like this:

          “I am being baptized today in obedience to Christ’s command, to publicly show my identification with the Lord Jesus Christ and to present a picture of the new life that I have in Him. I want you all to know that because of what my Savior did for me on the cross, I am a new creature in Him and all of my sins have been washed away. I now desire to follow Christ and to walk in newness of life, as He enables me to do so. My salvation depends on Christ’s work alone.”

          (Hypothetical testimonies from Middletown Bible Church website. Bold mine.)

          Water baptism is a symbol, a public declaration of the salvation the believer already has. It is in no way either a means or a condition of salvation.

          • louthesaint says:

            Take it up with the Apostles words as recorded in the New testament..That is what I have printed..

            here is some more scripture for you to ponder upon and try not to be applying your theological brand to them.
            Mk16:16
            Acts9:17,18
            Acts22:16
            Eph4:5
            Eph5:26
            Gal3:27
            Col2:12
            Rom6:3
            Acts8:2

          • louthesaint says:

            The precious blood of the lamb of God was shed for the remission of sins, For all have sinned.

            Grace = The Gift of salvation freely given to all who believe.. Faith recognises that the Blood was shed to remit sins.. Baptism applies the reality of the shed blood for the one who believes. It unites the believer to Christ death and resurrection in a personal relationship within the New covenant ratified by the Blood of Christ Rom6:3,4,5

    • Chuckles says:

      In the interest of addressing louthesaint’s confusion, I must respond to this.

      cyberpriest said:

      ‘By Faith alone’ does not negate the necessity for baptism

      Uh, regarding salvation, yes it does, if language means anything. “By faith alone” refers to receiving salvation. Baptism is necessary for obedience, but not for salvation. (See my remarks below.)

  9. hopeful_watcher says:

    No sense in arguing over the nature of the deception. Whatever is handed to us on a silver platter IS that very deception.

    So then what shall we do? What shall we say if dwarfs from Mars, fire breathing dragons from the hollow earth, aliens from the pleades or angelic hybrid demi gods descend upon the earth? We attack any deception with truth. This truth is not the truth of the nature of deception, but its the truth that makes all deceptions exposed to the light of God. That is that Jesus is our savior to all the worlds ills (even unto our death) and not any half baked worldly solution brought forth by the antichrist.

    However the deception takes form, this will be the general framework of That deception. There will be world wide calamities. They will have a solution to fix it that doesn’t include the redemptive power of Jesus’s death on the cross.

    • hopeful_watcher says:

      Let me put a finer point on this. I believe there was some truth to ancient Greek and Roman mythology. So as much as people today are waiting for an alien disclosure, they were waiting for half bred demi gods to come save humanity.

      The framework of the deception is the same. The details are filled in with whatever the current society is willing to believe.

      • Daniel says:

        Here! Here!

        “History” Channels Ancient Aliens is priming that component of this. I’m sure you’ve read Revelation 9:11 but I would like to point that passage out for the record.

        And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

        Apollo?!

        I agree, with what you say about the Truth for those that fight counterfeiters don’t waste their time studying all the fake, but the true article. However, I see so many Deists masquerading as Christens. They will consed to a risen Lord, but deny Jonah and the ‘whale’. They will believe in an almighty God but scoff at a 6 day creation. They agree with turning water into wine but think giants are fairy tails.

        I believe the reason for the deception is that the devices of Satan in which the Bible warns us about will/has been forced upon the populous without challenge. Also, it was the Truth, the whole Truth of God that the people rejected. Remember over 10% of the Bible speaks about the occult for a warning, so teaching about it does not go against scripture (2 Corinthians 2:11). That is the point of this webpage.

  10. Vic says:

    Thank you hopeful Watcher, well said, interesting point…keep watchin’.

  11. Paul says:

    Daniel,

    I enjoy your comments here, and I agree with them. (In fact, I was about to reply to one of the objections above, but you saved me the trouble by taking the words out of my mouth.)

    The passage in Second Thessalonians which you quoted is a fascinating one

    Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

    I’ve never heard a pastor preach on this! God Himself wants people who have pleasure in unrighteousness to be damned, and so He sends them a strong delusion to deceive them. It’s not exactly your touchy-feely “Jesus loves you” type message! But it’s true (and one can find parallels elsewhere in Scripture): the frightening truth is that there comes a point at which God no longer wants a certain person to repent, since they are so stubbornly wicked and love evil things so much. He hardens them and sends them on their way to perdition. …And it’s clear from the passage that this is the reason for the “strong delusion”. It’s very sobering.

    When I see many believers (e.g. Rob Skiba with his planned series Seed) trying to “warn the world” that the “strong delusion” is that fallen angels are masquerading as alien saviours, I see a big flaw in their plan: if the angel/alien thing isn’t the strong delusion, then these folks are barking up the wrong tree; however, if the angel/alien thing is the strong delusion then they’re fighting against God Himself. Warning the world about the strong delusion is trying to undo what God Himself is doing. We’re called to bear witness to those in the world of their sin and to call them to repentance: if they repent then they will not be affected by this delusion.

    • Daniel says:

      Thanks Paul, and I understand what your saying, however I remember my own conversion processes and I first started to question the mainstream line and in that questioning I found the truth. Someone (Alex Jones) was able to put a chink in Barack Obama’s armor as it pertained to my image of him. Calling the nephilim/ fallen angels out for what they are is no different then calling out the POTUS for what he is. There is only one path to God (Jesus) but many paths to Jesus (i.e. pick a testimony out of the billions from around the world/history).

      Those that believe in aliens need to have people that can challenge the main stream lie. However, its the believer of the false truths that has to go seeking for the Truth themselves. If sites like this is part of that path, then so be it and give God the glory!

  12. Vic says:

    Even giving some benefit of the doubt to all this, we do not know when all this
    delusion, or deception will take place…keep in mind there have been, hundreds of so-called theologians,
    scholars, mystics, etc. for millennia that have been wrong every single solitary time either with specific dates
    or even immediate time periods on the time of the end…All this could take place this year, next year, 5 years, or even 500 years from now…nobody knows, and 2 very important points here:…One, Scripture is clear not even the Angels are privy to that info, and Two, the Lord will come in an hour we think not, which right there destroys the 7 year tribulation theory, because people will EXPECT the Lord to arrive after this so-called 7 year tribulation theory
    espoused by hard core dispensationalists… I also think it’s personally somewhat arrogant to think that after Aaaaallllll of Human History going back hundreds of thousands of years going wayyyyyyyyy back to the Annunaki, that WE, us, are the generation that will see World History come to a close…come on guys, let’s step back from this just a bit, shall we?
    Nobody knows when, that’s the truth …nobody knows when…’point is to ready anyway, lest one sound like Chicken Little. Who was it that said ”The future’s uncertain and the end is always near”…well, whoever it was, he was right on that one.

  13. hopeful_watcher says:

    I can be honest and say it could be 500 years, but one thing I know is that we are in a very unique period of time. Daniel spoke that knowledge would increase. Jesus said we would see earthquakes in diverse places. 2000 years ago you could live in Jerusalem and have earthquakes literaly surrounding you in a 1000 mile radius and you would never know. Now we have an earthquake on the other side of the planet and we know in seconds. Jesus and Daniel were speaking of the information age. Our age. Not arrogance, just reality.

    No one knows the day, but we are to be aware of the season and those tender shoots on the fig tree are looking more ripe by the day. BTW, have you heard? Our savior is alive!! Have a blessed Resurrection Day.

  14. Vic says:

    Well, at least it could be 500 years, or longer, Daniel spoke of increased knowledge, but that “knowledge” could increase for a very VERY long time to the distant future (or not, who knows? there are no specifics there).

    Earthquakes in diverse places…no specifics on that one either, we have more technology to ‘see’ Earthquakes
    now, however we have more technology to see more crime around us with cameras everywhere now, that ‘doesn’t mean that crime is increasing, violent crime has me actually dropped like a rock in the last 30 years, and according to the exhaustively researched book “The Better Angels Of Our Nature”, we are in the most RELATIVELY peaceful time in World History, in comparison to our past! So we “see” more crime now and mistakenly believe the world’s going to hell in a hand basket, but not necessarily, that’s mainly because
    everybody and their Mother is walking around with a video camera now and because of that the perception,
    or maybe a better word is “illusion” that crime is skyrocketing to the stratosphere is just that..an illusion,
    and a powerful one at that, because images of crime can be powerful…but remember, violent crime is decreasing.

    One wishes the ‘Earthquakes in diverse places’ quote was more extremely specific, because they have been in diverse places for as long as mankind remembers, and if there were video cameras when these following Historical Earthquakes took place, one may conclude think the end was nigh back then as well.

    January 23, 1556, Shaanxi China, 820,000+ dead
    December 16, 1920, Gansu China, 273,000+ dead.
    May 21, 526, Antioch Turkey, 240,000+ dead
    December 28, 1908, Messina Italy, 123,000 dead
    October 11, 1138,Aleppo Syria, 200,000+ dead.
    etc. etc. etc….We’ve always had them, and I wish the Earthquake quote was more specific,
    I truly do, this way we can “gauge” the Scriptural warning more specifically, more pointedly, but it’s simply isn’t,
    and as history shows, it’s always unpredictable, and very difficult to “gauge” a time period Jesus was specifically
    alluding to, but we just don’t know…we just don’t know…we simply don’t, and that’s the truth…’blessed resurrection day as well.

    • Cyberpriest says:

      Often time People focus on Mat 24 for the signs of the end-times… There are three chapters that need to be seen in conjunction in order to have the full understanding of what Jesus was prophesying .

      Matthew 24
      Luke 21
      Mark 13

      I have no doubt whatsoever that the end time “Great Quakes, Plagues, famines and terrors and signs from heaven” (severe weather) Lk21:11 are upon us and that these things will intensify with the increase of wickedness upon the earth.

      All nations have received the Gospel message which is another sign of pending end. (the great commission is being achieved on a world scale)

      We are currently witnessing the eradication of the Gospel from the nations. A time of great darkness is rapidly approaching as it was in the days of Sodom & Gomorra..Those ensnared within cannot see the approaching judgment just as it was in the days of Noah.
      Like a thief The Great and Terrible Day of the Lord will arrive upon the wicked and they shall not escape..

    • hopeful_watcher says:

      Well, they didn’t have video cameras then (an invention of the info age) and the fact you can even assemble a historic account of these diverse earthquakes is directly attributable to the information age. I bet you Google’d it, no?

      Normally if someone gives you some kind of directional landmark to take a turn on a road, the landmark is very close to where the turn is. They don’t say, its when the road gets narrow and then the road is narrow for the next 500 miles.

      Be that as it may, caution is good. I’ve got no problem with your call to use discretion. Predictions by Harold Camping and the like make Christian prophecy a laughing stock. By the same token, I suppose those who lived in Sodom and Gomorah wished they took the preceding warnings with more urgency than they did.

  15. Vic says:

    Hopeful Watcher typed: “Well, they didn’t have video cameras then (an invention of the info age) and the fact you can even assemble a historic account of these diverse earthquakes is directly attributable to the information age. I bet you Google’d it, no?”

    Yes Sir, nothing wrong with that of course and thank God too, as many in ‘end is nigh’ seers in the past have relied on our ignorance to believe them.

    HW: “Normally if someone gives you some kind of directional landmark to take a turn on a road, the landmark is very close to where the turn is. They don’t say, its when the road gets narrow and then the road is narrow for the next 500 miles.”

    ‘And that’s exactly the trouble… in all of Church History post ascension, there never been one single solitary true Seer that has existed, interpreting with any true precision where to post that landmark, many scholars and mystics who supposedly were more educated than us have kept moving it….is it any wonder some of us have had enough of this nonsense? Who can blame us?
    Be Well.

  16. Charles says:

    Consolmagno is Talking About Baptizing Aliens Again. This is absurd. In the beginning God created heaven, and earth. The heaven is the realm of the pure spiritual creatures that God created, and not space. The earth is not a planet revolving in a solar system; but the unique and immoveable place that God formed and placed man. God did not create other worlds. Just earth. Catechism of the Catholic Church – Paragraph 215 – III. God, “He Who Is,” Is Truth and Love
    “The sum of your word is truth; and every one of your righteous ordinances endures forever.”30 “And now, O LORD God, you are God, and your words are true;”31 this is why God’s promises always come true.32 God is Truth itself, whose words cannot deceive. This is why one can abandon oneself in full trust to the truth and faithfulness of his word in all things. The beginning of sin and of man’s fall was due to a lie of the tempter who induced doubt of God’s word, kindness, and faithfulness.
    God Bless…

  17. Bernie says:

    Cris,

    I’ve read both P.R. and E.V. and just watched this video with Copeland and some guy named Tony Palmer with a video message from the pope. Seems awful strange to hear them say the RCC now accepts that salvation is by grace alone through faith and the pope wants us all to be brothers and sisters in Christ. As a former catholic I find this to be totally mind blowing and would love to hear your comments on it.

    Thanks,

    Bernie

    • Deirdre says:

      Come out of all of it! Ecumenical garbage meant to sweep you away into delusion! Seek FATHER on your own. The Holy Spirit in you will teach you all things you need to know and you will save yourself those precious moments GOD gives you, by not wasting time on the likes above.
      Peace,
      Deirdre

  18. Chuckles says:

    louthesaint said:

    The precious blood of the lamb of God was shed for the remission of sins, For all have sinned.

    Grace = The Gift of salvation freely given to all who believe.

    AMEN! Yes! That’s right! So why did you add this:

    Baptism applies the reality of the shed blood for the one who believes.

    ?

    Nowhere does scripture say that. Nowhere.

    louthesaint said again:

    Take it up with the Apostles words as recorded in the New testament..That is what I have printed..

    I’m afraid what you’ve done is take some of the words of the apostles… out of context.

    I’ll deal with your quotations, but first, since you like Scripture quotes, try these:

    John 1:12-13

    John 3:15

    John 3:16

    John 3:18

    John 3:36

    John 5:24

    John 6:35

    John 6:40

    John 6:47

    John 7:38-39

    John 11:25-26

    John 20:31

    Acts 2:21

    Acts 10:43

    Acts 11:17

    Acts 13:38-39

    Acts 15:11

    Acts 16:31

    Acts 20:21

    Romans 1:16

    Romans 3:22

    Romans 3:26

    Romans 3:28

    Romans 3:30

    Romans 5:1

    Romans 10:9

    Romans 10:11

    Romans 10:13

    1 Corinthians 15:1-2

    Galatians 2:16

    Galatians 3:2-9

    Galatians 3:14

    Galatians 3:24

    Galatians 3:26

    Ephesians 2:8-9

    1 Timothy 4:10

    2 Timothy 3:15

    Titus 3:8

    1 John 5:1

    1 John 5:11-13

    You will note that these passages deal with the “how” of salvation; the “what must I do to be saved” question. They are definitive on the matter. Yet none of them mention water baptism. If water baptism is necessary for the remission of sins, why doesn’t a single one of the above passages include it?

    For example; in Acts 10:43 Peter says,

    “Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him has received remission of sins.” (Bold and italics, mine.) Not “will, upon being baptized receive remission of sins”, no, it says “has received remission of sins.” No mention of water baptism.

    In Acts 16:30, the Philippian jailer asks Paul how to be saved. Paul tells him “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved…” There’s no mention of water baptism.

    Same with Ephesians 2:8 “For by grace you have been saved, through faith…” Faith is the means by which we access the grace of God for salvation (which includes the remission of sins). Water baptism is nowhere mentioned. Very strange for something which is supposedly “required”.

    And what of the thief on the cross, who acknowledged the Lord’s innocence? He was never baptized in water. Was the Lord wrong when telling him “This day you shall be with Me in Paradise”? That’s “saved”, isn’t it?

    What then, of the passages you cited? Let’s look:

    Mk16:16 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] If this verse taught that water baptism is required for salvation, it would have to pertain to baptism specifically, and it would have to be stated both ways. Iow, the last part of it would have to say something like:

    “He who has believed but has not been baptized shall be condemned.”

    But it doesn’t. The negative clause does not mention baptism at all. That is simply because–regarding salvation–baptism isn’t the issue, faith is the issue. It’s the heart which concerns God, not a religious ritual.

    Acts9:17 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] ,18 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)]
    Acts22:16 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] The event with Ananias took place some 3 days after Paul’s Damascus Road experience. When was Paul saved? When did he say to the Lord, “Who are You, Lord?” Immediately after being blinded and knocked to the ground. Paul addressed Jesus as “Lord” right then and there, demonstrating faith. Upon the Lord telling him who He is (Jesus), Paul acknowledged Him and submitted. Was not Paul saved at that point? If he wasn’t, then what does Romans 10:9,10 mean? Ananias assumed that he was already saved, addressing him as “brother Saul” upon meeting him. Paul had not been healed yet, but he was already saved by faith. Water baptism would be the beginning of Paul’s testimony, but it played no part in his salvation.

    Eph4:5 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] The context of Ephesians deals with the Church as the Body of Christ. The “baptism” referred to in verse 5 is not water baptism, it is the Holy Spirit baptism by which each believer is made a member of Christ’s body. This too happens at the moment of faith. Water baptism is a picture of this (and other things).

    Eph5:26 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Water baptism is not the subject here, nor is salvation. This passage deals with sanctification, not salvation. Plus, it is “the word”–symbolized by the term “water”–which is the cleansing agent in sanctification, not literal water.

    Gal3:27 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Again, the subject here is the Holy Spirit’s act of baptizing (submerging) the believer into the Body of Christ, not water baptism (the symbol).

    Col2:12 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Here again, water baptism is being employed symbolically, representing the believer’s death, burial, and resurrection with Christ. Just as the the believer’s (spiritual) death, burial, and resurrection is depicted here in the symbol, so too is the cleansing of sin included (in other passages) in the same symbol. But note: It is symbolic of things that have already happened (through faith in Christ), not of things that will happen as a result of the symbol.

    Rom6:3 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Here again, Paul mentions the believer’s death and burial with Christ, and how it changes the believer’s relationship to indwelling sin; that the believer is “dead to sin”. Paul’s use of water baptism as a reference demonstrates the symbolic nature of the ritual. Paul is expounding to them the meaning behind the ritual, but he never says that their death and burial happened at the time of the ritual. The ritual proclaimed their death to sin, but did not bring it about. So too is the symbolism of the washing away of sins, which is done by Christ’s blood the moment we believe in Him.

    1 Peter 3:20-21 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Here, Peter compares the refuge of Noah’s ark to the refuge we have as being “baptized into Christ” (Gal. 3:26,27), Christ Himself being our “ark”. Noah’s going “through the water” is compared to our coming out of the water, which is symbolic of our resurrection with Christ in whom we have “newness of life”, having been baptized (by the Holy Spirit) into Christ the moment we believed. It’s evident that Peter is not presenting water baptism itself as the means of our cleansing because of his disclaimer “not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God”. Peter was not referring to cleansing (it was the world that was cleansed by the flood, not Noah), but to having and proclaiming a “good conscience” through faith in Christ’s sacrifice.

    Acts8:2 [Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)] Maybe I’m just a bit tired, but I don’t see what point is made by mentioning Stephen’s burial.

    I don’t take issue with your statements at the top of this post regarding the grace of God. But, you’ve added water baptism as a requirement for salvation, which is horribly wrong. We cannot be too careful about the doctrine of salvation by faith alone. To add anything–anything–to simple faith in Christ’s sacrifice on our behalf for the remission of sins is the most serious heresy. It is at the heart of the Roman Catholic “faith plus works” heresy. Requiring baptism–or any human work–for salvation is quite literally “another gospel”.

    • louthesaint says:

      I have not added anything as the requirement of salvation.. To the contrary; it is you who omit the divine ordinance (baptism) established by Christ as unnecessary.. Faith & Baptism go hand in hand as does repentance..

      The ordinance of Baptism is not any human works unto salvation, It is the ‘working of God’ in raising the believer together with Christ Col2:12 Rom6:3-5

      Ananias told Saul to wash his sins away by baptism Acts22:16 “Arise and be baptised and Wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord” and saul obeyed..
      what is hard to understand in that statement. When did Saul get His sins washed away?

      It is as previously said ‘Faith alone’ does not negate the requirement and need for the believer to be baptised for the remission of his/her sins Acts2:38

      My Gospel is Apostolic and not another Gospel.. It is not I who has a theological stronghold bearing upon the Apostolic truth….

      You condemn another to easily my friend.. For your theological pride must be removed/repented of before the Lord opens up His Word to you.. It is no good parroting your masters lest you lead others astray..

      • Daniel says:

        Lou,

        I must confess that I worry for you. When you stand before God and he asks you why you deserve eternal life, if you answer anything other then I do not, it was Jesus on the cross that paid for my sin, then you have trusted your own works to try to obtain your salvation. That is pride. The second you start adding sacraments, rites, works or ordinances (Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; C0L 2:14) for your salvation, then you’ve just muddied the waters of the pure doctrine of Jesus Chris.

        Also, how do you know when the apostles were talking about baptism, they were not talking about baptism of the Holy Spirit by fire?

        Luke 3:16 – John answered, saying unto [them] all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

        I like the testimony of the thief on the cross the best. He could not wipe his nose for the remission of sin let alone get down off his cross and be baptized in water yet Jesus said he would be with him in Heaven, why? Because of his FAITH.

        Don’t get me wrong, I am baptized by immersion because it is my outward profession of an inward possession. However, I was saved in the fall and baptized by water in the spring. I did not fear Hell should I have died in the winter because I new the Holy Spirit lived inside of me when I invited him in and put all my trust on Jesus.

        • Chuckles says:

          Exactly Daniel. Right on.

          louthesaint, I spent several hours putting together my previous post in an effort to illustrate the relevant biblical issues to you. I dealt with each of the passages you quoted. In response, you have simply misquoted more Scripture, neglecting to address even one of the many Scriptures I referenced, each of which contradicts your false notions about baptism. I can only conclude that you do not wish to discuss the matter rationally, but are concerned merely with “revealing your own mind”. So be it. I will leave you to your own misconceptions.

          But I must warn you one last time: You are seriously wrong about a major issue which is central to the gospel: the relationship of faith to works. You are under the deception of a “different gospel”, which is not the gospel that saves. If you do not turn from that false gospel and believe the real gospel, you will miss the only salvation that God has provided, which must be received by faith alone.

          • Daniel says:

            Thanks Chuckles, just know that Lou is not the only one that is reading your posts. The word of God does not return void… that maybe becasue someone over heard your conversation who had ears to hear. Hang in there brother, can’t wait to meet you in Heaven (if not sooner).

        • louthesaint says:

          I will say the same to you as well..
          I have not added anything as the requirement of salvation.. To the contrary; it is you who omit the divine ordinance (baptism) established by Christ as unnecessary.. Faith & Baptism go hand in hand as does repentance..

          The ordinance of Baptism is not any human works unto salvation, It is the ‘working of God’ in raising the believer together with Christ Col2:12 Rom6:3-5

          Ananias told Saul to wash his sins away by baptism Acts22:16 “Arise and be baptised and Wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord” and saul obeyed..
          what is hard to understand in that statement. When did Saul get His sins washed away?

          It is as previously said ‘Faith alone’ does not negate the requirement and need for the believer to be baptised for the remission of his/her sins Acts2:38

          My Gospel is Apostolic and not another Gospel.. It is not I who has a theological stronghold bearing upon the Apostolic truth….

          You condemn another to easily my friend.. For your theological pride must be removed/repented of before the Lord opens up His Word to you.. It is no good parroting your masters lest you lead others astray..

          You and Chuckles are the ones in a theological trap You cannot receive the truth about baptism as a result.. Why don’t you pray about it and ask the lord to show you why he established the ordinance? I will go a step further and say that the entire grand commission of making disciples is tied up in the Words of Jesus “Baptise in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” “He who believes and is baptised will be saved”

          • louthesaint says:

            And it happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed uthrough the inland country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. And he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” And they said, “No, wwe have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.” And he said, “Into what then were you baptized?” They said, “Into yJohn’s baptism.” And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.” On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and cthey began speaking in tongues and prophesying. There were about twelve men in all.

          • jaz says:

            louthesaint, I have full comprehension of what you are saying about baptism and it’s application to Faith.

            You preach it saint.

            You will always have those who use theology (their interpretation of the scripture) to undermine The truth of God’s word.

            Believers baptism is as St Peter says (a Faithful appeal to God unto a Good/clear/Guilt free conscience. Not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the cleansing of ones conscience by the Blood of Jesus) 1Pet3:21, Heb10:22, Heb9:14

          • Chuckles says:

            louthesaint said:

            “You condemn another to easily”

            A warning is not condemnation. If you are condemned, it is by your own doing.

          • jaz says:

            chuckles; you are ignorant of spiritual reality, You are theologically Blind you poor soul.

            Why don’t you comment on the Apostles words
            “Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ”
            What do the words ‘Now saves You’ relate to and to what effect was it?

          • Chuckles says:

            jaz said:

            “chuckles; you are ignorant of spiritual reality, You are theologically Blind you poor soul.

            Why don’t you comment on the Apostles words” (quotes Peter)

            Jaz, if you were paying attention at all, instead of being so pre-occupied with mulling over your next set of insults to throw at me, you would have noticed that I addressed the issue of 1st Peter 3:20,21 already.

            Evidently, you’re not paying attention. That “it” spirit you claim to hear is distracting you, no doubt.

          • jaz says:

            Chuckles, I suggest that you remove your theological spectacles, as it is obscuring your perception of truth..
            You literalists are all the same, you spiritualise as needed that which should not be spiritualised…

            The words “Now saves you” in Vs21 cannot be rendered to anything else but the ‘faithful baptism of the believer’

          • Chuckles says:

            jaz said:

            You literalists are all the same, you spiritualise as needed that which should not be spiritualised…

            It’s not spiritualising to take the whole counsel of God into account, and apply it accordingly.

            Speaking of “the whole counsel of God”, I can’t help but notice how you continue to ignore the forty passages I listed.

            Perhaps your “theological spectacles” are blinding you to them. (That “it” spirit you hear could also have something to do with it.)

            The words “Now saves you” in Vs21 cannot be rendered to anything else but the ‘faithful baptism of the believer’

            The phrase “faithful baptism of the believer” appears nowhere in the verse or its context!

          • jaz says:

            Chuckles; The whole counsel of God includes the necessity of the believers Baptism something very compatible with The Grace of God.

            You are drawing Gnats by saying this (The phrase “faithful baptism of the believer” appears nowhere in the verse or its context!)
            Nowhere in scripture does it say ‘Grace alone’ either. but we know that salvation is by Grace through Faith and faith applies the Divine ordinance of baptism as it does repentance (a godly sorrow for sin) Acts2:38

            The word ‘alone’ is Luther’s addition to express the sovereignty of Grace in opposition to works and I agree with Luther that works has no place with Grace. But Baptism is not works although it can become thus, a Formality by rites and rituals conducted without personal faith in Christ.

            Below is what Louthesaint printed above , I suggest you study it carefully.
            (And it happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed uthrough the inland country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. And he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” And they said, “No, wwe have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.” And he said, “Into what then were you baptized?” They said, “Into yJohn’s baptism.” And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.” On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and cthey began speaking in tongues and prophesying. There were about twelve men in all.)

          • Chuckles says:

            jaz said:

            Chuckles; The whole counsel of God includes the necessity of the believers Baptism something very compatible with The Grace of God.

            What a blatantly self-contradictory statement!

            The “necessity” of water baptism for salvation is totally incompatible with the biblical teaching of salvation by grace through faith. (Romans 4:5)

            You know, RC-ism maintains that the necessity of receiving Christ in the Eucharist is “something very compatible with The Grace of God” too, claiming that receiving the Eucharist is not a “work”, but is the “means by which God’s grace is accessed”. They are wrong, of course. Well, it’s the same logical construct you use with baptism.

            And you still ignore those 40 passages which contradict you. Does your concern for “the whole counsel of God’ extend any further than your interest in defending your own error?

            Below is what Louthesaint printed above , I suggest you study it carefully.

            In no way does that passage support the idea that baptism is necessary for salvation. You and Louthesaint read such into the passage. I suggest you study the Bible more carefully.

  19. Charles says:

    Genesis Chapter 1: God createth Heaven and Earth, and all things therein, in six days. Here, God reveals His Truth in Scripture. In the Gospel according to Saint John 18:37 {37} Pilate, therefore, said to him; Art thou a king then? Jesus answered; Thou sayest that I am a king. For this was I born, and for this came I into the world, that I should give testimony to the truth: every one that is of the truth, heareth my voice.
    God’s Order: or Galileo ? I hear Jesus and say “Yes Lord” God’s Order… God Bless…

  20. Deirdre says:

    Here’s my take on it: If you have come out of the RCC and fiddle faddled around in the Protestant church only to find that they are all related, then come out of “her” all the way people. Who really cares if the RCC is going to baptize supposed alien brothers? Let the delusion continue to prove who are really HIS!
    No need to ‘warn the people of this aweful thing the RCC’ are going to do or have been doing. The HOLY SPIRIT will call whom are HIS. But the choice/will on the remnants part is to “come out of her my people and touch NO UNCLEAN thing” It is a monumental waste of GOD’s time. “Make the most of every opportunity for the days are evil”.
    Prepare yourself as the Bride does. Your dress is getting dirty if you know what I mean….Hide yourself away!

    • Daniel says:

      Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. – Romans 16:17

      • jaz says:

        To Which doctrine is this verse referring? The answer would have to be the ‘Apostles doctrine’
        But it seems that there are those who would apply the Apostles words to the formulation of The manyfold theological doctrines of man.
        so, we have catholics marking Protestants, protestants marking Catholics, Dispensationalists marking reformed and the list goes on.
        That is why churches arrange their own constitutions, it is to safeguard their doctrine, very often their Heretical doctrine which they pridefully defend by marking any who will not accept their error.

        It is a pitiful situation into which Christians have been snared and the call to come out is as real today as it was when written by the Apostle on Patmos.

  21. Charles says:

    Just read the article. Pope says baptism for all – even Martians. Well, I guess it’s time to “Get that Monkey off their back” And if we know these guys, they will go ahead and give them at the same time, the other sacraments of, Confession, Communion, and top it off with Confirmation…… Who is to say, they won’t get a few to receive Holy Orders…… And what do you bet we might get a green alien Pope someday. He could bless the oils for the sacrament of the sick… Which at this point I think these folks need it… God Bless …

  22. Charles says:

    Get your Baptismal font’s ready………… Aliens Are Almost Definitely Out There, SETI Astronomers Tell Congress
    The Huffington Post |

    Posted: 05/22/2014 4:04 am EDT Updated: 05/22/2014 10:59 am EDT Print Article

    Aliens almost definitely exist.

    At least, that’s what two astronomers told Congress this week, as they appealed for continued funding to research life beyond Earth.

    According to ABC News, Dan Werthimer, director of the SETI [search for extraterrestrial intelligence] Research Center at the University of California, Berkeley, told the House Committee on Science, Space and Technology Wednesday that the possibility of extraterrestrial microbial life is “close to 100 percent.”

    “In the last 50 years, evidence has steadily mounted that the components and conditions we believe necessary for life are common and perhaps ubiquitous in our galaxy,” said Werthimer in his written testimony, adding: “The possibility that life has arisen elsewhere, and perhaps evolved intelligence, is plausible and warrants scientific inquiry.”

    Werthimer’s colleague Seth Shostak, a senior astronomer at the SETI Institute, also told Congress that he believes our chances of finding extraterrestrial life are high.

    “The chances of finding it I think are good and if that happens it will happen in the next 20 years depending on the financing,” Shostak told the committee. (Watch the full hearing here.)

    This isn’t the first time in recent months that Congress has held a hearing on aliens. In December, the Science House Committee held a two-hour hearing about the ongoing search for extraterrestrial life. The Wire said at the time that the hearing was the “best thing Congress [had] done in months.” Just a thought ! If these aliens want to be baptized, then, did God not give them on their planet the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ ? But upon their arrival here on earth, the Holy Spirit fills their minds and then suddenly they desire God and his plan of salvation through his Son our Lord Jesus Christ ? P.S. This alien thing is just absurd. God Bless…

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